Saturday, January 17, 2009

Like the Nazis, Except for Good

Rick Warren compares his "radical movement" to some rather unsavory historical figures:

via Buzzflash

Of course, I am sure we are taking these righteous words out of context. It would have to be a VERY large context.

Godwin's Law states, "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches one."

I don't think Godwin was referring to a situation where the leader was essentially saying, "Hey, the Nazis were bad, but they were successful. Let's be Nazis for the good." It throws the probability curve right off the chart.

Great formula. What could possibly go wrong?

(Not to rain on Prez elect Obama's parade, but there were thousands of conservative clergypeople to choose from besides this one. Ah well, I welcome the transition. Eight years was enough of that certain someone and his sidekick.)


Hypatia said...

Rick's brainwashing techniques show his weakness...religious fundamentalism at it's worst. There is NO DIFFERENCE between what he' is advocating and Islam's radicals...which have shown "whatever it takes" includes

1. Blowing up buildings (9/11 anyone? Get your 70 virgins if you become a martyr for the cause!)

2. Threatening free speech (the Danish cartoon fiasco & Salman Rusdie's so-called "assault" on the Muslim faith)

3. Control over women's bodies - no access to abortions or birth control, pledging one's virginity to one's FATHER!!, making a "Quiverfull" of babies as warriors for god (while letting the woman's uterus prolapse into her vagina in the process)

4. Fleecing of the flock to finance personal jets, New York condos, and other ridiculous frippery...

Dave said...

There is a general assumption that the Church is full of conservative fundementalists. This could not be farther from the truth. There are just as many liberals in the church as well. Take for instance the Episcopalians. They just split up because of the gay bishop issue.

Don Snabulus said...


There is a line between spreading the good news and forcing the good news. When that line is crossed, bad things can and do happen. It appears that Warren isn't seeing that line.


Last I heard, the figure for conservative Christians in the US is about 25%. I am not sure whether that percentage refers to the whole population or just Christians.

General observations,

I was trying to think of positive groups Warren could have referred to. However, most positive things that happen are mass movements of people that want something. If Warren mentioned those, then it wouldn't be about him or his church. He says it is about Jesus, but he sure likes to be the center of it.

I also thought about what it would have been like to be a conservative Christian sitting in the stadium who was appalled when these historical monsters were mentioned as possible role models. Imagine the pressure to put up the "Whatever it takes" sign when in a state of horror over what had just been said. I am willing to bet there were more than a few holding signs that wanted to be out of there.

Whatever my differences are with the more conservative folks out there, I am confident the vast majority don't want to see themselves as Nazis. After all, the Nazis were convinced God was on their side until the Allies showed them otherwise. It was a hard lesson, but one the vast majority of left and right leaning Americans are well aware of.

The Moody Minstrel said...

Hypatia, you forgot to mention the suppression of objective, research-based science. Most of the world is already scratching its collective head over the beating evolution has been taking in American schools and libraries.

Brown shirts. Little red books.

And thus radical Christian fundamentalism shows its true colors. Sadly, it's no different from radical fundamentalism of any other religion.

Arkonbey said...

Wait, who was G.W.B a sidekick to?

and not to seem to be gluing rose-colored glasses to my face, but Warren was recently seen meeting with actual homosexuals. Since I believe that it's easier to hate those you never meet, perhaps this bodes well? I've always thought if some of these fundies can come to dinner with one of the monogamous, loving gay couples we know, they might at least tone down their rhetoric.

@hyp: as the inestimable Mr. Carlin said: "religion can be a lift in your shoes, just don't go nailing them to other people's feet"